5th November 2004
Further to the previous post, I’m pleased to announce that the battle over the plagiarism of CollyLogic‘s XHTML and CSS has been successfully resolved. So, I feel it’s best not to publicly “out” those responsible, although I have selected a few choice quotes from the email conversations…
I have received a number of emails from the two companies involved in the last 48 hours. I even received a panicky email from the wife of one. Thankfully, all of the changes I requested have been made, and the site in question now doesn’t really resemble CollyLogic at all - well, maybe under the hood a little.
I suppose you are a little disappointed that I wont be “releasing the hounds” on this one. So, I thought I’d share a few quotes from their emails. I think they show how well they responded to my emails. I am not sharing these to give you more ammunition. I mean, do leave comments, but if you find out who the designers are, don’t name them here. Right then…
“AAHHHH! I’m freaking out over here. My husband has been gone since yesterday and is on his way home as I write this. It should be about 6:00 that he gets here. I’m dieing (sic) to talk to him and I’m sure he’s going to shit his pants when he gets the bad news…I don’t know exactly how these things work but it sounds pretty bad. Sincerely crapping my pants.” (The Wife)
“I stumbled across your site and read the “ticked off” tutorial and loved it, wanted to use and did. I couldn’t get it to work in a structure I built and basically was running out of time trying to build and test my own css, my deadline was coming up soon. So I used your structure and changed what I needed to fit it with my design.”
“Simon I feel like the biggest shit on earth, I am the biggest shit on earth, and I know you can smell me from across the ocean. I was out of my league but was scared to admit it. I should have stuck to tables but didn’t. I was so desperate to learn css and implement it, I forgot to notice the line I crossed in the process.”
“I am actually thinking of changing careers and just leaving the internet behind me. This whole ordeal just completely emptied me as a man, I am ashamed, embarrassed and I can’t even look my wife in the face. And to top it all off, it is my own damn fault.”
“(*****) is the one who created the site and he is no longer with my company. This just gives me another reason why I’m already re-designing the site as well as more justification of getting rid of him.”
“Please let me know if you still feel it matches exactly your design in anyway and let me know suggestions on what I should change and I will do it. I’m basically going to change backgrounds, ticks, etc. to resemble the style of the website and make it completely different than yours.”
“Again, though, please let me know if you have more requests. I will be working more on the site tomorrow. Also, I can’t say thank you enough for everything. My client is also aware of what all has transpired, just for your peace of mind.”
“Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. I can’t say it enough. I’m glad to meet your requirements on the graphical end. I did want to change the CSS names but as you mentioned, it would be a nightmare to change it in every file. You have handled yourself very appropriately and above the call. I’m glad that (*****) is also complying and was responsive to your emails in a professional manner. I guess we can all learn from this as time goes on.”
Please note, the employer also CC’ed the client in on his last two emails. So, no need to release the URLs. I’m actually quite concerned that the employee has now shut his portfolio/blog, and is apparently dissolving his business. I know you all think I’m soft, but the email from him was quite eloquent, and explained things well. Yes, we can all write bullshitty emails, but he was going on about standards and not wanting to use tables. He was learning, and under pressure. Equally, his former employer spent 24 hours recoding the CSS, making new images and so on. He too took time to explain himself, and neither of them suggested I was in any way out of line to badger them to alter the design.
Well, I learned that you lot are bloodthirsty werewolves, who’ll rip any unsuspecting pirates limb from limb at some kind of archaic kangaroo court. Seriously though, I realised that it’s possible to keep the upper hand in this kind of dialogue. Face-to-face, I may have acted less forcefully, whereas through email, it’s possible to wield a bit of power and balance out the good webcop/bad webcop personas. It’s also quite useful to point the pirates to a blog entry full of support comments and suggestions of torture.
I also spoke to a few boffins about law on this one. I think I’ll dedicate a full post to this in the near future. Suffice to say, get screengrabs of the rip-off site - all the similarities. Get screengrabs of the CSS and XHTML also. Keep copies of all email dialogue, preferably as a “Reply-to” conversation. Having such weapons can only assist you if things move further. Threaten to send Cease And Desist notifications, and even give a date as to when you intend to do this.
From a human point of view, don’t give up. It is possible to force your point and resolve the issue through the friendly/nasty alternation in emails. I’m well aware that most would simply publish the names and URLs straight away, and I did want to do that. Instead, I emailed these to trusted bloggers who assured me that I was right to pursue the issue.
Ah, look. I’m tired of it now. All’s well that ends well. My thanks and respect to those that will remain unnamed, for the way they conducted themselves, and for making the amendments. Nobody got hurt, nobody died. Maybe I am disappointed not to be hanging them in this article, but fuck it. Life’s too short.
Still, thanks for all of your comments and advice. Do you think I handled this the right way? Should I have named them in case they do it again? Keep an eye on your referral stats, and watch out for pirates. Hoist the main brace…
# Louise responded on 5th November 2004 with...
FWIW I think you did the right thing. It is a fine example of how to deal with these situations.
If you want a professional and conciliatory response from the offender, then you should behave in a professional and conciliatory manner yourself.
If, on the other hand, you get unhelpful, abusive, “I don’t give a ****” responses, despite your best efforts and professional approach, then it’s time to decide if it’s worth the financial and time burdens of persuing it via lawyers, or to just name and shame and let the ‘net community rip ‘em apart.
If it’s a business, then the laywer route would be most appropriate.
If it’s a hobby site, any victory in the courts is likely to be a Phyrric victory after paying out for lawyers and taking time off work. In such circumstances, naming and shaming may achieve the desired result. I would do it only as a last resort.
# John responded on 6th November 2004 with...
You, sir, have way more class and restraint than I ever could have. I salute you.
The dogs of war are still hungry. Now whatever shall I do?
# Jeremy Flint responded on 6th November 2004 with...
Good result, IMO. I guess the designer and agency were lucky in that you were willing to let them make their wrong right.
Some people would have just blasted them right off the bat.
Although I can still see some similarities in the site, I think its as good as it will get without a complete redesign.
Good job Simon.
# Seth responded on 6th November 2004 with...
Simon, I agree, I think you did the right, professional thing. You carried yourself well with the whole situation, granted we only received a piece of the whole pie from your blog postings, but from what you’ve said, everything came out with as little blood shed as possible.
It certainly has been a wonderful learning experience for all us, as I have a similar situation that I’m worried may escalate, so I have been making small preparations in case things get a little dicey.
# John Oxton responded on 6th November 2004 with...
Simon,
You handled the situation like an absolute gent, I am pleased you go the result you were looking for.
At least next time you have a post armed and ready for action! :)
bloodthirsty werewolves
Bloodthirsty I ain’t but… well you’ll see ;)
# Simon Collison responded on 8th November 2004 with...
Yes, I do feel like a fine, upstanding gentleman now.
Seth: Good luck with your pirates.
Jeremy: I agree, it certainly a lot better than it was - definitely enough to satisfy me. It may be pretty much the same under the hood, but because the sites don’t look too similar, I don’t think anyone will confuse the two designs.
John: Hicks tells me a strange wolf-like figure has been spotted stalking the Oxfordshire countryside of late. Anything to do with you?
Louise: More sound advice - thanks for posting it here.
# Gordon Mackay responded on 8th November 2004 with...
Simon,
you are truly an inspiration in anger management :)
To most of us finding out something disturbing like that would have been like a red rag to a bull, but I am pleased to see that taking stock of things and approaching the situation calmly paid off for you.
Hopefully we can all learn from this.
# Phil Baines responded on 8th November 2004 with...
Good show indeed! It always makes me cringe when I see this ‘community’ of our ripping some poor guy apart, even if they do ‘deserve it’.
The way you have dealt with this situation shows that you can get the desired results and remain both professional and a better kind of human being at the same time. Weldone!
# Gabriel Mihalache responded on 10th November 2004 with...
I *wish* someone would plagiarize me! Then I’d know I’ve “made it”. Until them, I’ll have to satisfy with getting snubbed by css vault/beauty/stylegalla :-(
# Kitta responded on 11th November 2004 with...
You really are a true gentleman Simon. ;o)
I’ve had my code, images, content and even blog entries stolen in the past and I’ve always called them out on it, but after reading the above I now think differently about it.
Ok, except for that Supershadow guy who stole my pictures and claimed I was his girlfriend. That was just plain weird.
# Kev responded on 26th November 2004 with...
Well, you’re a nicer guy than me :o)
I’m of the opinion that learning a new technique should be applied to personal sites and nin-client sites until such a time comes that one is proficient enough to build a client site in the new technique. Using bleeding edge techniques to build a client site is not a great idea IMO and I’m not sure its a very good excuse either.
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